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March 15, 2007

Comments

Maggie

"... If they and their ways are good, then their deeds are radiant. If you are righteous, then what you do will also be righteous. We should not think that holiness is based on what we do but rather on what we are, for it is not our works which sanctify us but we who sanctify our works"

I get tangled here. I think of God in the OT sancitfying his best and most set apart artists for leading the people into worship. It is He who sanctifies us and calls us to specific works. I'm not so sure it is for us to choose the work or the venue.

I will say that I have trouble worshipping to a song I thought was to praise my One and Only Most High God and then hear the same song in the middle of long songs in the grocery store as if it could go either way, depending on what you happen to be thinking about at the time. It knocks the shine off my love song to God to hear it sung to any Tom or Jane. It just saddens me and I can't explain why. I like His songs to be His songs. I don't want to be halfway through a song and wonder if I'm praising my spouse or thinking of my God. Both are worthy and songs can work that way, but I just don't like my brain mixed up with purpose. I don't know if anyone else has this trouble or not, but it's a big thing for me.

Anyone else?

Diane (Yippy)

I wish we could edit our posts on blogs once they've been submitted...The grammar-nazi in me is annoyed with myself. OK, good night. :)

Diane (Yippy)

Quote from Iain: "Heck, people don't say "I'm a Secular Sculptor" do they?"

I was just thinking about that the other day (because of this blog)...I was on my way to work thinking that I used to be a "believer-ceramist" and now I'm a "believer - church secretary." It sounded so funny to me. "Believer-artist" sounds so much more dignified than "believer-secretary." :D I would venture to say that we usually use "Christian" as an adjective when we want to make a distinction between how the "world" does it and how we do it. A secretary is a secretary and is going to do administrative things. But a "Christian" band implies that their music is "g-rated" or about "relationship with Jesus or the effects of" instead of sex, drugs, love gone bad, etc. I just bought a couple of CDs by Glen Kaiser, a Christian blues singer/musician. I love the blues, but I know longer cry in my beer, so I sought out some blues that I could listen to that I could relate to...I still listen to "secular" blues, but some of it is just too whiny for me... :D I agree with you that people can be embarrassed by the "Christian" tag...Having been born again during the Jesus Movement of the 70s, I can tell you that I've had to overcome being embarrassed by the term, and still cringe at the term "witnessing." Well, I've rambled enough. Christian mom signing out. ;)

Iain MacKinnon

I think there are a couple of issues here.

Firstly, there's ease of use. OK, not using 'christian' as an adjective is something I've heard over and over and I agree with that, but the majority of people DO use it that way, so for ease of comprehension I don't think it hurts too much to use it that way.

Secondly, I think a lot of us carry a fair degree of embarassment about the 'christian' tag. Not because we're ashamed of our faith, but because of what our faith has come to mean to so many people. If a lot of christians had carried the name of christ with greater honor, then people would consider the 'christian' label a more positive thing.

I think a few others have made the last point before me. If you are an artist, you are an artist. Heck, people don't say "I'm a Secular Sculptor" do they? Most art I've seen or heard doesn't have to specify what it's about in its title. Surely the subject matter should be clear when you listen to it or look at it?

I am a christian. I play in a rock band. We sing songs in the band which are about faith and life and stuff (whether or not Jesus is directly referenced - he is a part of my whole life and I hope my life reflects that, even if I'm not singing about him!), and because our faith is christianity, for the sake of clarity and to avoid seeming like I've been hiding something, I usually just say to people that I play in a christian rock band. It tells them what they want to know, even if I would rather phrase it differently.

I just don't know if 'believer-artist' is any more helpful a term to do this than 'christian band/artist'.

This is really interesting... :0)

Mark

Actually the point of the post was the idea of the "believer-artist". I just got a little fired up about the semantics thing :)

Ami

I know this discussion was more about the semantics deal than about the Christian band vs band of Christians thing but I found the latter to be interesting. My husband is a huge Alice Cooper fan. Huge. Most don't know that Alice is a Christian. His children are also believers. Can you even imagine the kind of flack Alice must catch from his peers? What about Dave Mustaine? He was the front man for Megadeath and not too long ago turned his life around. He became a believer as well. I love stories of mainstream musicians who get saved. It is inspiring and encouraging to see these guys become lights in a very dark world. Forgive me for going so off topic but this entry just made me start thinking along these lines :-)

Diane (Yippy)

[QUOTE]Great point. I too am not a fan of nit-picking, but this kind of arguing isn't exactly what I'm referring to here. Perhaps that phrase "let's not get into semantics" is just overused.[QUOTE]
Like a lot things. :)

Mark

Good point, Corrine.

Here's the quote in context (at least as much as I could find online:

"People should not worry as much about what they do but rather about what they are. If they and their ways are good, then their deeds are radiant. If you are righteous, then what you do will also be righteous. We should not think that holiness is based on what we do but rather on what we are, for it is not our works which sanctify us but we who sanctify our works."

Corrine

"People should not worry as much about what they do but rather about what they are."

Doesn't what you do declare what you are? I think more people should worry about whose they are.

MarkLee

"O, but I really do hate it when people argue in circles and it really is just semantics. Sometimes it just is."

Great point. I too am not a fan of nit-picking, but this kind of arguing isn't exactly what I'm referring to here. Perhaps that phrase "let's not get into semantics" is just overused.

Melanie

When I hear the phrase about semantics I generally think of someone twisting words to make their point, which is probably a bigger peeve of mine than actually getting into what the words mean, which I prefer. A believer-artist works. Just "artist" works as far as that goes. I rather like Jon Foreman's comment that they are Christians by faith, not by genre (or something to that effect.)

I like the quote, especially how you used it - out of context or not. :)

Diane (Yippy)

O, but I really do hate it when people argue in circles and it really is just semantics. Sometimes it just is.:D

Traci

"Christian" shouldn't be used as an adjective. It should be a noun. (Or maybe a verb...)

Wendy

I love this quote (can I use it too??)

"People should not worry as much about what they do but rather about what they are."

I believe that most people don't even know what they are...that's the problem. What's the other saying.....You have to stand for something or you will fall for anything...

I think you are a great believer-artist and I look forward to whatever you create.

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